Discussion:
Recovery Rate Six Times Higher For Those Who Stop Antipsychotics Within Two Years.
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Greg Carr
2021-02-23 01:05:21 UTC
Permalink
Recovery Rate Six Times Higher For Those Who Stop Antipsychotics Within Two Years
New research finds that people with "serious mental illness" who stop taking antipsychotics after initial treatment are more likely to recover, even accounting for baseline severity.

Peter SimonsBy Peter SimonsFebruary 22, 20218
971

A new study by Martin Harrow, Thomas Jobe, and Liping Tong found that odds of recovery from “serious mental illness” were six times greater if the patient discontinued antipsychotics within two years. The study followed patients with schizophrenia and affective psychosis (bipolar and depression with psychotic features) diagnoses for 20 years. The study was published in Psychological Medicine.

Specifically, the researchers found that those who stopped taking antipsychotic medication within two years of first taking the drug were almost six times (5.989) more likely to recover from “serious mental illness” and were only 13.4% as likely to be re-hospitalized.

“Regardless of diagnosis, after the second year, the absence of antipsychotics predicted a higher probability of recovery and lower probability of rehospitalization at subsequent follow-ups after adjusting for confounders,” the researchers write.
That “after adjusting for confounders” is important. Critics of findings such as these argue that the data is explained by people with more severe symptoms taking the drug, while people with less severe psychosis stop taking the drug—although there is no evidence that this is the case.

However, the researchers did their best to account for this possibility by adjusting their model to account for factors such as the specific diagnosis and/or the baseline severity of symptoms. This is called “controlling for” or “adjusting for” the confounding factor.

Harrow et al. controlled for this confound by controlling for “prognostic potentials.” At the first interaction, participants were assessed on several “prognostic” measures (the Valliant, Stephen’s Symptomatic Prognostic Index, and Zigler’s Prognostic Index). These measures allowed the researchers to sort the participants into poor versus moderate prognostic potential—or likelihood of recovery. The measures included items like symptom severity and education level; age, sex, race, drug and alcohol use, marital status, and the number of previous hospitalizations were also accounted for.

“Even when the confound by indication for prescribing antipsychotic medication is controlled for, participants with schizophrenia and affective psychosis do better than their medicated cohorts.”
According to the researchers, some studies have shown that some patients derive a short-term benefit from using antipsychotic drugs. Most of these studies take place over the course of a few weeks to months. However, people diagnosed with schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and even depression are often prescribed antipsychotic drugs for long-term use—for the rest of their lives, in many cases.

But research into long-term outcomes has found a disturbing picture. According to Harrow et al., “Multiple studies indicate that after 2/3-years of antipsychotic treatment, persons with schizophrenia and affective psychosis not prescribed anti-psychotic medication start performing better than patients with those prescribed antipsychotic medications.”

So why is taking an antipsychotic drug associated with worse outcomes? According to Harrow et al., antipsychotic-induced dopamine super-sensitivity psychosis may play a role. Because antipsychotics block dopamine receptors, the body may compensate by increasing sensitivity to dopamine. This, in turn, could cause increased psychosis.

According to Harrow et al., 30% of people with schizophrenia who take antipsychotics may experience super-sensitivity psychosis; 70% of those diagnosed with “treatment-resistant” schizophrenia may experience it.

Harrow, Jobe, and Tong’s findings are consistent with a growing body of literature that finds long-term antipsychotic use to be harmful rather than protective. Harrow and Jobe have previously published the 15-year and 20-year outcomes from this study, both of which were consistent with this result.

Wunderink’s study of patients with first-episode psychosis also found that patients who discontinued antipsychotics were twice as likely to recover than those who continued taking them. Researchers have also found that a large percentage of patients experience no further psychotic episodes despite not taking antipsychotics; this has led to the acknowledgment that antipsychotics are unnecessary for at least some group of patients.

In summary, Harrow, Jobe, and Tong write:

“These and previous data indicate that after 2 years, antipsychotics no longer reduce psychotic symptoms and participants not on antipsychotic perform better.”

****

Harrow M, Jobe TH, Tong L. (2021). Twenty-year effects of antipsychotics in schizophrenia and affective psychotic disorders. Psychological Medicine, 1–11. https://doi.org/10.1017/S0033291720004778 (Link)

https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/02/stop-taking-antipsychotics-six-times-likely-recover-serious-mental-illness/

I quit all my medication before the pandemic. My sleep has improved (9 hours yesterday) I am taking melatonin and and Nyquilzzz and magnesium at night. Hallucinations are not worse. Adult tourette's is bad but less. Tardive is way better.
David Dalton
2021-02-23 03:55:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Greg Carr
Recovery Rate Six Times Higher For Those Who Stop Antipsychotics Within Two Years
New research finds that people with "serious mental illness" who stop taking
antipsychotics after initial treatment are more likely to recover, even
accounting for baseline severity.
Peter SimonsBy Peter SimonsFebruary 22, 20218
971
A new study by Martin Harrow, Thomas Jobe, and Liping Tong found that odds of
recovery from “serious mental illness” were six times greater if the
patient discontinued antipsychotics within two years. The study followed
patients with schizophrenia and affective psychosis (bipolar and depression
with psychotic features) diagnoses for 20 years. The study was published in
Psychological Medicine.
Specifically, the researchers found that those who stopped taking
antipsychotic medication within two years of first taking the drug were
almost six times (5.989) more likely to recover from “serious mental
illness” and were only 13.4% as likely to be re-hospitalized.
“Regardless of diagnosis, after the second year, the absence of
antipsychotics predicted a higher probability of recovery and lower
probability of rehospitalization at subsequent follow-ups after adjusting for
confounders,” the researchers write.
That “after adjusting for confounders” is important. Critics of findings
such as these argue that the data is explained by people with more severe
symptoms taking the drug, while people with less severe psychosis stop taking
the drug—although there is no evidence that this is the case.
However, the researchers did their best to account for this possibility by
adjusting their model to account for factors such as the specific diagnosis
and/or the baseline severity of symptoms. This is called “controlling
for” or “adjusting for” the confounding factor.
Harrow et al. controlled for this confound by controlling for “prognostic
potentials.” At the first interaction, participants were assessed on
several “prognostic” measures (the Valliant, Stephen’s Symptomatic
Prognostic Index, and Zigler’s Prognostic Index). These measures allowed
the researchers to sort the participants into poor versus moderate prognostic
potential—or likelihood of recovery. The measures included items like
symptom severity and education level; age, sex, race, drug and alcohol use,
marital status, and the number of previous hospitalizations were also
accounted for.
“Even when the confound by indication for prescribing antipsychotic
medication is controlled for, participants with schizophrenia and affective
psychosis do better than their medicated cohorts.”
According to the researchers, some studies have shown that some patients
derive a short-term benefit from using antipsychotic drugs. Most of these
studies take place over the course of a few weeks to months. However, people
diagnosed with schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and even depression are often
prescribed antipsychotic drugs for long-term use—for the rest of their
lives, in many cases.
But research into long-term outcomes has found a disturbing picture.
According to Harrow et al., “Multiple studies indicate that after 2/3-years
of antipsychotic treatment, persons with schizophrenia and affective
psychosis not prescribed anti-psychotic medication start performing better
than patients with those prescribed antipsychotic medications.”
So why is taking an antipsychotic drug associated with worse outcomes?
According to Harrow et al., antipsychotic-induced dopamine super-sensitivity
psychosis may play a role. Because antipsychotics block dopamine receptors,
the body may compensate by increasing sensitivity to dopamine. This, in turn,
could cause increased psychosis.
According to Harrow et al., 30% of people with schizophrenia who take
antipsychotics may experience super-sensitivity psychosis; 70% of those
diagnosed with “treatment-resistant” schizophrenia may experience it.
Harrow, Jobe, and Tong’s findings are consistent with a growing body of
literature that finds long-term antipsychotic use to be harmful rather than
protective. Harrow and Jobe have previously published the 15-year and 20-year
outcomes from this study, both of which were consistent with this result.
Wunderink’s study of patients with first-episode psychosis also found that
patients who discontinued antipsychotics were twice as likely to recover than
those who continued taking them. Researchers have also found that a large
percentage of patients experience no further psychotic episodes despite not
taking antipsychotics; this has led to the acknowledgment that antipsychotics
are unnecessary for at least some group of patients.
“These and previous data indicate that after 2 years, antipsychotics no
longer reduce psychotic symptoms and participants not on antipsychotic
perform better.”
****
Harrow M, Jobe TH, Tong L. (2021). Twenty-year effects of antipsychotics in
schizophrenia and affective psychotic disorders. Psychological Medicine,
1–11. https://doi.org/10.1017/S0033291720004778 (Link)
https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/02/stop-taking-antipsychotics-six-times-like
ly-recover-serious-mental-illness/
I quit all my medication before the pandemic. My sleep has improved (9 hours
yesterday) I am taking melatonin and and Nyquilzzz and magnesium at night.
Hallucinations are not worse. Adult tourette's is bad but less. Tardive is
way better.
I have been on olanzapine since early 2005 but luckily these
days I am only on 7.5 mg nightly (as a top up to 1000 mg
of divalproex sodium, a mood stabilizer that replaced lithium
for me in early 2013) and hope to go down to 5 mg within
the next few months. (But If I come out of my low years
into a sustained period of centred clarity, which I equate
with awakening/enlightenment, I might be able to gradually
taper off my medications for good.)
--
David Dalton ***@nfld.com http://www.nfld.com/~dalton (home page)
http://www.nfld.com/~dalton/dtales.html Salmon on the Thorns (mystic page)
“And now the angry morning/Gives the early signs of warning/You must face
alone the plans you make/Decisions they will try to break" (Sarah McLachlan)
Greg Carr
2021-02-23 12:15:31 UTC
Permalink
Olanzapine was totally useless for me. I had a coworker who took lithium back in the 1990's he was fat and the slowest employee and eventually the voices were screaming so loud in his head he had to quit. He had once been the curator of an art gallery. All his siblings were art gallery curators or lawyers but he couldn't hold a job just above minimum wage.
Post by David Dalton
Post by Greg Carr
Recovery Rate Six Times Higher For Those Who Stop Antipsychotics Within Two Years
New research finds that people with "serious mental illness" who stop taking
antipsychotics after initial treatment are more likely to recover, even
accounting for baseline severity.
Peter SimonsBy Peter SimonsFebruary 22, 20218
971
A new study by Martin Harrow, Thomas Jobe, and Liping Tong found that odds of
recovery from “serious mental illness” were six times greater if the
patient discontinued antipsychotics within two years. The study followed
patients with schizophrenia and affective psychosis (bipolar and depression
with psychotic features) diagnoses for 20 years. The study was published in
Psychological Medicine.
Specifically, the researchers found that those who stopped taking
antipsychotic medication within two years of first taking the drug were
almost six times (5.989) more likely to recover from “serious mental
illness” and were only 13.4% as likely to be re-hospitalized.
“Regardless of diagnosis, after the second year, the absence of
antipsychotics predicted a higher probability of recovery and lower
probability of rehospitalization at subsequent follow-ups after adjusting for
confounders,” the researchers write.
That “after adjusting for confounders” is important. Critics of findings
such as these argue that the data is explained by people with more severe
symptoms taking the drug, while people with less severe psychosis stop taking
the drug—although there is no evidence that this is the case.
However, the researchers did their best to account for this possibility by
adjusting their model to account for factors such as the specific diagnosis
and/or the baseline severity of symptoms. This is called “controlling
for” or “adjusting for” the confounding factor.
Harrow et al. controlled for this confound by controlling for “prognostic
potentials.” At the first interaction, participants were assessed on
several “prognostic” measures (the Valliant, Stephen’s Symptomatic
Prognostic Index, and Zigler’s Prognostic Index). These measures allowed
the researchers to sort the participants into poor versus moderate prognostic
potential—or likelihood of recovery. The measures included items like
symptom severity and education level; age, sex, race, drug and alcohol use,
marital status, and the number of previous hospitalizations were also
accounted for.
“Even when the confound by indication for prescribing antipsychotic
medication is controlled for, participants with schizophrenia and affective
psychosis do better than their medicated cohorts.”
According to the researchers, some studies have shown that some patients
derive a short-term benefit from using antipsychotic drugs. Most of these
studies take place over the course of a few weeks to months. However, people
diagnosed with schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and even depression are often
prescribed antipsychotic drugs for long-term use—for the rest of their
lives, in many cases.
But research into long-term outcomes has found a disturbing picture.
According to Harrow et al., “Multiple studies indicate that after 2/3-years
of antipsychotic treatment, persons with schizophrenia and affective
psychosis not prescribed anti-psychotic medication start performing better
than patients with those prescribed antipsychotic medications.”
So why is taking an antipsychotic drug associated with worse outcomes?
According to Harrow et al., antipsychotic-induced dopamine super-sensitivity
psychosis may play a role. Because antipsychotics block dopamine receptors,
the body may compensate by increasing sensitivity to dopamine. This, in turn,
could cause increased psychosis.
According to Harrow et al., 30% of people with schizophrenia who take
antipsychotics may experience super-sensitivity psychosis; 70% of those
diagnosed with “treatment-resistant” schizophrenia may experience it.
Harrow, Jobe, and Tong’s findings are consistent with a growing body of
literature that finds long-term antipsychotic use to be harmful rather than
protective. Harrow and Jobe have previously published the 15-year and 20-year
outcomes from this study, both of which were consistent with this result.
Wunderink’s study of patients with first-episode psychosis also found that
patients who discontinued antipsychotics were twice as likely to recover than
those who continued taking them. Researchers have also found that a large
percentage of patients experience no further psychotic episodes despite not
taking antipsychotics; this has led to the acknowledgment that antipsychotics
are unnecessary for at least some group of patients.
“These and previous data indicate that after 2 years, antipsychotics no
longer reduce psychotic symptoms and participants not on antipsychotic
perform better.”
****
Harrow M, Jobe TH, Tong L. (2021). Twenty-year effects of antipsychotics in
schizophrenia and affective psychotic disorders. Psychological Medicine,
1–11. https://doi.org/10.1017/S0033291720004778 (Link)
https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/02/stop-taking-antipsychotics-six-times-like
ly-recover-serious-mental-illness/
I quit all my medication before the pandemic. My sleep has improved (9 hours
yesterday) I am taking melatonin and and Nyquilzzz and magnesium at night.
Hallucinations are not worse. Adult tourette's is bad but less. Tardive is
way better.
I have been on olanzapine since early 2005 but luckily these
days I am only on 7.5 mg nightly (as a top up to 1000 mg
of divalproex sodium, a mood stabilizer that replaced lithium
for me in early 2013) and hope to go down to 5 mg within
the next few months. (But If I come out of my low years
into a sustained period of centred clarity, which I equate
with awakening/enlightenment, I might be able to gradually
taper off my medications for good.)
--
http://www.nfld.com/~dalton/dtales.html Salmon on the Thorns (mystic page)
“And now the angry morning/Gives the early signs of warning/You must face
alone the plans you make/Decisions they will try to break" (Sarah McLachlan)
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